5.4 Demonology Guide

5.4 Demonology Guide

254 Sparkuggz
Added by September 10, 2013

introduction
Welcome to the Warlock guide for the Demonology spec in Mists of Pandaria Patch 5.4

*NOTE* There will still be updates during 5.4 and i will add video guides together with more detailed playstyle tips and tricks as we go along.  

This guide will try cover many different areas to help you improve your play, do note that many things can change and rotations, stat weights, priority lists and all these sort of things can differ a lot. Always read guides with a grain of salt, but use it for what it’s worth.


BIS T16 HC gear list (Mastery focused)

SLOT ITEM NAME ENCHANT STATS DROPS
Head Hood of the Horned Nightmare Thok the Bloodthirsty
Neck Untainted Guardian’s Chain Norushen
Shoulders Mantle of the Horned Nightmare Crane Wing 200 int / 100 crit Siegecrafter Blackfuse
Chest Robes of the Horned Nightmare Glorious Stats +80 all stats Sha of Pride
Waist Belt of Ominous Trembles   Juggernaut
Legs Leggings of Furious Flame Cerulean +285 int / 165 crit Juggernaut
Boots Bone-Inlaid Sandals Pandaren’s Step +140 Mastery Galakras
Wrists Avool’s Ancestral Bracers Super Intellect +170 Intellect Spoils of Pandaria
Gloves Gloves of the Horned Nightmare Superior Mastery +170 Mastery General Nazgrim
Finger Iyyokuk’s Hereditary Seal   Paragons of the Klaxxi
Finger Signet of the Dinomancers   Thok the Bloodthirsty
Trinket 1 Purified Bindings of Immerseus   Immerseus
Trinket 2 Black Blood of Y’Shaarj   Garrosh Hellscream
Back Xing-Ho, Breath of Yu’lon Superior Intellect +180 Intellect Legendary Questline
Main Hand Immaculately Preserved Wand Jade Spirit Spoils of Pandaria
Offhand Revelations of Y’Shaarj Major Intellect +165 Intellect Garrosh Hellscream 

 

Trinket List

This list is based on 571~ item level from Siege of Orgrimmar and tries to value each trinket individually.  Take it as a rough estimate of the trinket values, note that it’s not 100% accurate and using some trinkets together might bring a worse or better combination, but use it as a thumb rule of how well they do

 

Spell warlock darkregeneration Dark Regeneration – Instant 30% of maximum health for you and your pet plus 25% increased healing taken over 12 seconds. A very good talent for a survival phase with damage taken over a short period of time, but not superior on fights with steady damage taken.

Warlock siphonlife Soul Leech – The passive healing talent for our main attacks and will most likely be the used talent for Affliction on the fights to help out healers.

Spell warlock harvestoflife *NEW 5.4* Harvest Life – Increases the damage of your Drain Life spell by 50% and the healing of your Drain Life spell by 150%. (Passive)

When-to-use guidelines:

  1. Soul Lech – Simply brings a good passive shield to absorb damage
  2. Dark Regeneration – Really useful on a few fights where you want the extra healing and cooldown
  3. Harvest Life – Mainly a PvP talent, not so much use in PvE

*NEW 5.4* Demonic Breath – Replacement of Howl of Terror, new Cone of Cold like CC. Mainly usedi n PvP

Ability warlock mortalcoil Mortal Coil – Deathcoil with a 15% heal we can use in PvE

Ability warlock shadowfurytga Shadowfury – AoE stun without much use in PvE

When-to-use guidelines:

  1. Mortal Coil – 15% health for a GCD
  2. Shadowfury – Small stun, often times other classes bring mroe reliable and longer lasting stun
  3. Demonic Breath – Not much use besides PvP, can be useful for slowing the adds on a boss like Immersus

 

Ability warlock soullink *NEW 5.4* Soul Link – No longer shares health pool with your pet, instead 20% of all damage you take is split to your pet. Additionally, 3% of all damage you deal is converted into healing on you and your pet.

Warlock sacrificial pact Sacrificial Pact – A very solid absorb shield, which sacrifices 25% of your pets health to give a 400% shield of the sacrificed health. This talent can even be used in certain situations without a pet as you will lose 25% of your health for 400% of the lost health turning into a shield.

Ability deathwing bloodcorruption death Dark Bargain – Absorbs all damage for 8 seconds and when the shield fades you take 50% of the damage over 8 seconds. Risky if you take a lot of damage and suddenly will get bursted down when the absorb fades.

When-to-use guidelines:

  1. Soul Link – Passive 20% damage reduction is really good, espeically if we also use the Unending Glyph for 10% more
  2. Dark Bargain – Very good “oh shit” talent, that can save us in a lot of dire situations and works well with soaking
  3. Sacrificial Pact – This talent can be very good to take with high pulsing AoE’s at certain times in a fight, the shields are very big

*Soul Link still increases your health pool if you don’t have a pet and use Grimoire of Sacrifice, but most of the time you would want to run with another talent then depending on the fight.

 

Ability deathwing bloodcorruption earth Blood Horror – When activiated any time a enemy melee attacks you and deals damage, the enemy will run in horror for up to 4 seconds

Ability deathwing sealarmorbreachtga Burning Rush – 4% of maximum health per second for 50% movement speed.

Warlock spelldrain Unbound Will – Removes all magic and impairing effects

When-to-use guidelines:

  1. Burning Rush – Useful speed boost in many situations, you can nearly always find a use for it
  2. Unbound Will – Very cool self dispell, but only has its place on a few fights
  3. Blood Horror – Purely PvP talent, not much use in Pve

Warlock grimoireofcommand Grimoire of Supremacy – 20% more damage from our pets and they turn into different versions of themselves

Warlock grimoireofservice Grimoire of Service – Summons another pet of your choice  for 20 seconds

Warlock grimoireofsacrifice Grimoire of Sacrifice – Sacrifices our pet to increase our single target damaging spells and Wild Imp’s

When-to-use guidelines:

  1. Grimoire of Service – Strong 2 minute cooldown lined up with Dark Soul and gives us a pet for good fury regeneration. The best and most commonly used Grimoire for Demonology.
  2. Grimoire of Sacrifice – Increses single target damage spells but also Wild Imp’s, this talent is useful on fights where we have a lot of Doom’s running with 100% crit for endless Imp army to boost it’s damage furtermore
  3. Grimoire of Supremacy – The “lazy” version of Service, it doesn’t do too bad, but just makes your Felguard a Wrathguard with 20% more damage, would only take on fights where Service becomes useless or unavaible to use at right times

Achievement boss archimonde *NEW 5.4* Archimonde’s Darkness – Your Dark Soul has two charges

Achievement boss kiljaedan *NEW 5.4* Kil’jaeden’s Cunning – You can cast Malefic Grasp, incinernate and Shadow bolt while moving

Achievement boss magtheridon *NEW 5.4* Mannoroth’s Fury – Increases AoE by 500% and the damage from Immolation Aura and Hellfire by 100%. 60 sec CD, 10 sec duration.

When-to-use guidelines:

  1. Archimonde’s Darkness – Basically the talent you pick when there is no AoE or heavy movement involved, it gives us a better management of when we want to use Dark Soul instead of using it on cooldown
  2. Mannoroth’s Fury – Very good talent for burst AoE fights, worth taking on a lot of fights in Siege of Orgrimmar
  3. Kil’jaeden’s Cunning – Not really needed as Demonology, but in case your movement hurts your DPS too much you can pick this to help you out

 

There is no DPS increasing glyphs as Demonology. Glyph of Imp Swarm had its Imps reduced from 5 to 4, which no longer makes it mandatory.

*With the 30% nerfs to Wild Imp’s its no longer worth it to ever use Glyph of Imp Swarm

*NEW 5.4* Glyph of Everlasting Affliction has been replaced by  Glyph of Eternal Resolve.

*NEW 5.4* Glyph of Dark Soul has been replaced by  Glyph of Curse of the Elements.

*NEW 5.4*  Glyph of Shadowflame has been replaced with  Glyph of Unending Resolve.

*NEW 5.4*    Glyph of Imp Swarm now summons 4 Wild Imps (down from 5 Wild Imps).

 

Major Glyphs

 Glyph of Eternal Resolve - If no major cooldown is needed, 10% passive reduction is really nice together with 20% from Soul Link.

 Glyph of Siphon Life - Passive healing with not many alternatives to pick

 Glyph of Healthstone , Life Tap or Soulstone – 3rd option you pick and choose depending on the fight

 

Stats are a very touchy subject, so to determine what stats we want we need to know what they actually do and bring.

Mastery increases the damage done by the warlock’s demons as well as the warlock’s damage while in caster form and while under the effects of Metamorphosis. It’s a pure raw damage increasing stat for Demonology which scales really well when we spend more time inside Metamorphosis. That also explains why it’s such a good stat on multi target and AoE fights, because those are where we both spend more time inside Metamorphosis and we want to burst higher damage for the AoE.

Haste is our stat that decreases  our cast time thus increases damage and fury regeneration(more Metamorphosis uptime), pet energy gain and also helps us reach haste cap for extra tick of dots. It’s still a very strong single target stat, despite no longer scaling with RPPM, but stacking it endlessly is just not worth it inside instances. Theoretically on single target fights, it might come out ahead but it never does in practice. It’s the middle road stat that brings both damage and helps us cast faster, regen fury faster and in general reach dot caps.

Critical strike is generally our worst stat, it increases damage by giving you crits and as Demonology every Doom tick that crit’s spawn an Imp. Soul Fire now crits 100% and the damage is increased by Critical Strike like Chaosbolt. Now because we play with UVLS and roll 100% crit dooms that also devalues this stat significantly. It has no place on AoE or the damage board against mastery and therefore end up as the last in line stat to go for.

 

*Patch 5.4 update to stats post nerfs*

Generally we always want to aim for something like this priority list, because on most multi target/AoE fights Mastery will do well with reaching certain haste caps depending on your item level.

Int > 15% Hit > Haste(Cap) > Mastery > Haste > Crit

 

Single target: (Theoritically best)

Int > 15% Hit > Haste > Mastery > Crit

Haste and mastery is within 1-2% DPS of each other, so it’s not big deal which one you choose. Mastery buffs our damage in Metamorphosis which should work well for AoE fights. The haste is good because it help our pet damage and fury regeneration. We can spend more time inside Metamorphosis spamming Soul Fire and with 2P T16 we want the best possible uptime on the 20% damage buff.

 

My guidelines would look something like:

Int > 15% Hit > Haste (8097) > Mastery > Haste > Crit

You can consider optimizing the haste at higher item levels, but the DPS difference is minimal (1-2%) on Single Target. If i find some suiting haste levels in higher item levels, i’ll update the current guidelines. 

 

The only caps we really aim for as Demonology would be haste caps around Doom or Shadowflame ticks, Corruption is nearly irrelevant as Demonology because the damage is so low.

 Doom haste caps

Number of ticks
 
5
6
7
8
- Raid Haste 3036 13153 23276 33389
- Raid Haste + (BL/Hero) N/A 310 8097 15876
 

 Shadowflame haste caps

Number of ticks 7 8 9 10
- Raid Haste 1330 8064 14873 21596
- Raid Haste + (BL/Hero) N/A N/A 1633 6805
11 12
 - Raid Haste + (BL/Hero) 11981 17204
 

Spell shadow abominationexplosion Corruption haste caps

Number of ticks 10 11 12 13
- Raid Haste 231 4717 9211 13737
- Raid Haste + (BL/Hero) N/A N/A N/A 759
14 15 16 17
- Raid Haste + (BL/Hero) 4198 7658 11113 14604

 

As you may notice, there isn’t many caps in between our current gears Haste values. If we aim for 13k+ haste we often times sacrifice a lot of Mastery to get it. Generally with a heavy Mastery build we just aim to go for the Haste cap close to our passive Haste, so in case you are at 11.900 Haste, you could gain 81 more haste and get an extra tick of Shadowflame.

 

Single target stat weights

If you want to find your stat weights and specific values for purely single target fights (not reflected so much in Siege of Orgrimmar) you can use Simulationcraft to determine how to gem and gear. Remember that it doesn’t apply on AoE, multi or single target fights with burst mechanics.

Gems are helping us boost stats we choose, that also means that there is no determined gemming. If we want more of a stat for certain fights, gems are where we can find those stats. If you are around some haste cap, you obviously want to replace some of these gems with the haste version. These are just general guidelines for when we go with the heavy mutli target / AoE and all around strongest build for Demonology.

Socket Gem
Meta (Legendary)  Sinister Primal Diamond
Meta  Burning Primal Diamond
Prismatic
 Fractured Sun’s Radiance (320 Mastery)
Red (high hit)  Artful Vermilion Onyx (80 Int / 160 Mastery)
Red (low hit)  Keen Vermilion Onyx (160 Exp / 160 Mastery)
Yellow  Fractured Sun’s Radiance (320 Mastery)
Blue  Sensei’s Wild Jade (160 Hit / 160 Mastery)

 

IconSmall Blacksmithing Blacksmithing 320 Intellect or 640 secondary stats
IconSmall Tailoring Tailoring 320 Intellect on average~
IconSmall Leatherworking Leatherworking 320 Intellect
IconSmall Engineering Engineering ~320 Intellect  on average but can be synced with cooldowns
IconSmall Jewelcrafting Jewelcrafting 320 Intellect  or 320 secondary stats
IconSmall Alchemy Alchemy 320 Intellect
IconSmall Inscription Inscription 320 Intellect
IconSmall Enchanting Enchanting 320 Intellect
IconSmall Herbalism Herbalism/ IconSmall Skinning Skinning 480 haste~ / 480 Critical Strike
IconSmall Mining Mining 480 Stamina

 

Engineering, Tailoring, Herbalism and Blacksmithing  is at the moment the best profession for us as a warlock.

Engineering provides a great burst lining up with cooldowns and “on use” / high intellect procs will always be superior to passive stats. Blacksmithing is still good because it gives us 640 secondary stats, and secondary stats gain a high value on AoE + multi target fights.

If you choose either of the 4 you are save to go, but there is a rather big difference from rest of the professions to these 4, so it does matter what you choose.

Consumables

 

Baseline Level
Spell shadow shadowbolt  [Shadow Bolt]
Spell shadow abominationexplosion  [Corruption] 3
Spell shadow burningspirit  [Life Tap] 16
Demonology Specific
Level
 [Demonic Fury] 10
 [Metamorphosis] 10
 [Demonic Leap] 12
 [Soul Fire] 13
 [Hand of Gul'dan] 19
 [Hellfire] 22
 [Touch of Chaos] 25
 [Nether Plating] 27
 [Wild Imps] 32
 [Doom] 36
 [Summon Felguard] 42
 [Carrion Swarm] 47
 [Demonic Rebirth] 54
 [Immolation Aura] 62
 [Cursed Auras] 67
 [Molten Core] 69
 [Decimation] 73
 [Chaos Wave] 79
Mastery:  [Master Demonologist] 80
 [Dark Soul: Knowledge] 84
 [Void Ray] 85

 

Rotation priority

 Dark Soul: Knowledge

 Grimoire: Felguard

 Glyph of Imp Swarm (if glyphed and always lined with Dark Soul)

 Felguard: Felstorm on CD unless there will be AoE

 Metamorphosis

 Doom (on all targets that lasts for atleast a tick)

 *Soul Fire (if Fury allows and/or procs are up: Trinkets, Tempus Repit etc.)

 Touch of Chaos

Spell shadow abominationexplosion Corruption (on longer lasting targets)

 **Hand of Gul’dan when you are about to have 2 stacks (HoG trick)

 ***Soul Fire when  MC is up (depends on the fight)

Spell shadow shadowbolt Shadow Bolt

Spell fire felfirenova Fel Flame (while moving)

 

Spell_Fire_Fireball02 * Soul Fire and Metamorphosis is the main thing to figure out to min max Demonology spec. We need to always consider when to Soul Fire and when can’t we Soul Fire inside Metamorphosis. So we need to set up a few   thumb rules and general guidelines we want to use it. There is no mechanical playstyle to Soul Fire use, it’s purely based on a lot of factors and us predicting how the fight is about to go and timers of our cooldowns.

Never Soul Fire without Molten Core Procs

What do we always look at first when we judge if we should be Soul Firing?

Fury management

We always want to be sure we have the fury or don’t need the fury for AOE or incoming Dark Soul / major cooldowns and / or burst. If you just used Dark Soul and then your trinket procs, we can easily use Soul Fire’s because we don’t really care about dumping the fury. As long as we have enough time to build up fury for our major cooldown (Dark Soul), we are good.

Touch of Chaos vs Soul Fire (Haste)

Soul Fire does more damage, has a cast time and scales with everything. Touch of Chaos is instant, which means it hurts us to ToC with haste buffs up (Bloodlust, Legendary Meta Gem and such).Every time we have a haste buff up, we want to consider to either be outside Metamorphosis or using Soul Fire’s inside

Dark Soul

Any time we have Dark Soul up and we get 30% damage increase, we always want to burst and try to save a few Molten Core procs for Soul Fire. It’s essential that we spend a lot of time doing maximum damage with the mastery increase from Dark Soul. With 2P t15 it allows us to spend more fury during Dark Soul and makes Soul Fire more lucrative too.

Trinket procs

When trinkets are up, we want if fury allows to spend some Soul Fire’s inside Metamorphosis

Tempus Repit ( Meta Gem)

We always want to either go out of Metamorphosis or use Soul Fire’s with haste procs, ToC doesn’t scale well with it, so we would waste the meta gem if we just used ToC. Again it’s a judgement call of “what else is active? Trinkets? Do I need the fury or not?”

 

Ability_warlock_handofguldan** Hand of Gul’dan trickYou want to track Hand of Gul’dan so that you can cast one charge of HoG and it will land, then shadowflame appears on the target for 6 seconds and 2-3~ seconds before it expire you cast the 2nd HoG so it will land and renew the shadowflame to x2 stacks and you go STRAIGHT into Metamorphosis which buffs the Shadowflame dot damage with Metamorphosis % damage.You can normally fill 2-3 Shadowbolts or Soul Fire’s between the HoG’s depending on your Haste.Wait until the 2nd HOG has 4-5 seconds left or 3/4rd of the CD complete to cast the first HoG, then it will come off cd just in time. That way we don’t waste having 2 HoG off cooldown and a total uptime of Shadowflame on the targets. If you wait until both HoGs fully recharged you will loose both shadowflame uptime, molten core procs, fury and damage over an entire fight. Never sit on 2 HoG charges unless we save them up for AoE scenarios during a fight.

 

Spell_Fire_Fireball02*** Theoritically it might not be beneficial to use Molten Core procs outside Metamorphosis on single target fights, but in theory it’s a great way to be sure we have enough fury for when we want it during Dark Soul and AoE scenarios which is most of the fight these days. My thumb rule is always to save some Molten Core procs for Dark Soul and else try to balance my Fury to always have enough for when i need it. 

 

AoE rotation priority

When we look at how we want to AoE we need to figure out if its short AoE burst or long lasting AoE. There is no point to spread dots on short lasting targets and there is no point to do Hand of Gul’dan’s on mobs that die in 5 seconds. General thumb rule for AoE is +3-4 targets.

 

Outside Metamorphosis

 Hand of Gul’dan (x2 stacking, you can keep 2 charges ready if you know AoE will come. Be sure to go inside Metamorphosis after casting it)

 Hellfire

 

Inside Metamorphosis

 Metamorphosis: Immolation Aura

 Carrion Swarm

 Chaoswave (only used if the targets are alive for a shorter period of time than HoG’s Shadowflame will tick)

 Void Ray (Filler)

 

General

 Felguard: Felstorm

 Grimoire: Felguard

 

If targets last long enough, be sure to spread Doom and Corruption

 


Best races for Demonology Warlock
‘ Troll and orc is close, but they are still far superior from other races.

Horde: Troll Berserking
Alliance: Worgen Viciousness Darkflight

 

With Glyph of Imp Swarm

 

Without the Glyph of Imp Swarm

 

Video Guides Video guides related to Demonology will appear here

*NOTE* There will still be updates during 5.4 and i will add video guides together with more detailed playstyle tips and tricks as we go along.  

 

Donations are greatly appreciated <3“Donations are greatly appreciated if you want to help me keep running things <3.”

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254 Comments

  1. Drugshock
    Drugshock 10 September, 2013, 15:24

    Thanks a lot for this, sir.

  2. Peanutfish
    Peanutfish 10 September, 2013, 15:33

    The more I look at it the simpler it gets. But it’s still not simple.

  3. Totally
    Totally 10 September, 2013, 15:49

    Great guide buddy!

  4. solilock
    solilock 10 September, 2013, 15:59

    wanna that nice guide for affli aswell:-D

  5. Tîm
    Tîm 10 September, 2013, 16:05

    Thanks a lot.

  6. Nea
    Nea 10 September, 2013, 16:08

    Good job Sparkuggz, this spec is still the best of the three and i’ll enjoy doing SoO

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 10 September, 2013, 20:01


      Affliction is most likely slightly ahead of Demonology on single target, pulls more ahead on higher ilvl’s too. I will try to make the 5.4 Affliction guide as soon as possible!

      • Markowitz
        Markowitz 11 September, 2013, 16:31

        Hi Spark,I’m wondering if the mastery is the same important for affli spec in the SoO. would you recommend a stat build for the affli spec?

        • Sparkuggz
          Sparkuggz 11 September, 2013, 19:01


          Yea, Mastery is still good so no need to stack other stats tbh and you can easily swap between specs.

  7. kluggie
    kluggie 10 September, 2013, 17:42

    Thanks again for the fast guide and the good info, i have 1 question tho… sadly i didnt have the trinket UVoLS and there for never played a proper demo spec in 5.3… is the trinket still as important as it was in 5.3?? cheers kluggie

    • Peanutfish
      Peanutfish 10 September, 2013, 17:56

      “UVLS is still a good trinket up until BiS gear, so don’t replace it, especially not on multi target fights.”

      I’m going to guess yes……

  8. Swk
    Swk 10 September, 2013, 19:39

    Waiting for Maximize DPS series with every boss on youtube channel!

  9. Adun
    Adun 11 September, 2013, 09:07

    Hi Spark finde den Guide sehr gut würdest du auch einen für Destro machen wäre dir sehr dankbar^^

  10. Gorgonzola
    Gorgonzola 11 September, 2013, 12:32

    Hey Sparkuggz!
    Awesome post!
    It’ll be great if u add an “Opening Sequence” info.
    Thank you!

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 11 September, 2013, 18:55


      I will do that when i find time, need to get the Affliction one out too

    • Liquidsteel
      Liquidsteel 12 September, 2013, 10:05

      If it helps, the 5.3 opening rotation still works perfectly. UVLS procs nicely ~5 seconds in as usual.

  11. Liquidsteel
    Liquidsteel 11 September, 2013, 14:15

    You recommend keeping UVLS. Didn’t see the heroic version drop, so stuck with normal.

    Gonna keep using it purely because demo will be my offspec (afflic too stronk) and want to keep a mastery/haste focused gear setup.

    How much worse is normal UVLS vs hc/hctf? Worth dropping for heroic SoO trinkets?

    If so, do we then go mastery > crit > haste?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 11 September, 2013, 18:56


      Yea, use UVLS forever for now, it’s not worth replacing with anything, maybe in BiS gear Blackblood + Amplifier might do good.

      LFR UVLS is still better then most HC trinkets in SoO.

      Not much point to stack crit at any point

  12. Elvador
    Elvador 11 September, 2013, 21:15

    Why would you use the 4p set bonus over the haste/mastery off-set items?

  13. Sparkuggz
    Sparkuggz 11 September, 2013, 22:47


    12-09-2013: Added 5.4 trinket list in 551 ilvl

  14. Devil
    Devil 11 September, 2013, 23:53

    Tanks you for this guide and everything are u doing for the community.

  15. Jenna
    Jenna 12 September, 2013, 00:15

    Hey,
    Just wanted to say thanks for getting this guide up, switched today to Demo from Affliction – Safe to say not the best time to switch the night before a new raid :P
    But your guide tips helped, so thanks!

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 12 September, 2013, 01:01


      Thanks, but yea not the best timing to change specs : ) Remember Affliction is still really strong single target!

  16. Sora
    Sora 12 September, 2013, 00:47

    Was wondering if you could tell how herbalism “pulls” ahead vs tailoring/blacksmithing. Also, is herbalism the profession to go for as ally (havn’t seen a single one using it)

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 12 September, 2013, 01:02


      Herbalism is better when you are a troll because you stack haste to a higher level and play with Glyph of the Imp Swarm too. It’s still a good talent, lines up with DS but they are all within pretty reasonable DPS difference. Will probably update with some charts later on!

  17. Sparkuggz
    Sparkuggz 12 September, 2013, 01:00


    12-09-2013: Added Race difference in DPS charts

  18. Gondo
    Gondo 12 September, 2013, 16:06

    Might be worth mentioning the interplay between soulfire and the T16 2pc. In that you don’t want to waste procs of the 2pc by casting soulfire while the buff is active.

    Only issue so far is the loss of everlasting affliction glyph, I had a very specific timing of things to keep doom and corruption up 100% and now that is all messed up.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 14 September, 2013, 01:58


      Yea that’s a good idea to add, but need to be more convinced what the 100% best way to handle it would be!

  19. Nerzhul
    Nerzhul 12 September, 2013, 21:29

    Hey Sparkuggz!
    Nice guide, thank you very much.I have an orc warlock with enchanting/tailoring, is it worth going with the Imp Swarm glyph or not?One more question.In your opinion what is the best opening sequence now?

    • Nerzhul
      Nerzhul 12 September, 2013, 21:38

      OK.Dont even bother with my questions, Im just tired and missed the last part about the races and the comment about the opner xD

  20. Smexy
    Smexy 13 September, 2013, 18:36

    i read somewhere that this patch it looks like it might be haste(bp) >crit >= mastery

    • Smexy
      Smexy 13 September, 2013, 18:48

      i meant to add more to this, it was more of a question, as in should i continue to get more mastery over crit, or equal them out, what are your thoughts

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 14 September, 2013, 01:59


      On purely single target WITHOUT UVLS crit might have a bit higher value, but it’s still a bit bullocks. You still want to play with UVLS, so Mastery stacking for the win just like Throne of Thunder, nothing changed really.

  21. Philip
    Philip 13 September, 2013, 21:33

    Any chance you could add haste caps for when you have the amp trinket?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 14 September, 2013, 02:00


      Hm, what do you mean? The Amplified trinket just adds % to your mastery and should showcase properly in the sheet, so your sheet haste raiting = correct raiting.

  22. Misty
    Misty 14 September, 2013, 07:16

    So if you don’t have the UVLS should I go with crit,haste and then mastery or mastery, crit and the haste?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 14 September, 2013, 12:56


      Debateable, i would still priority mastery over crit, but crit should have higher value than haste after haste cap

  23. Misty
    Misty 14 September, 2013, 13:52

    Thanks I’ll try that =)

  24. Trebor
    Trebor 15 September, 2013, 10:48

    HI, Im thinking running demo/afflic for 5.4 raids but I dont want to reforge every spec change, what haste cap should I go for? Demo’s 9k ish of Affic 10k ish? I do have the exact numbers saved on reforge just cant remember exact right now ;) Thanks

    • Trebor
      Trebor 15 September, 2013, 10:53

      Forgot to say just now my ilvl is 540

      • Sparkuggz
        Sparkuggz 15 September, 2013, 11:25


        8097 / 9778 is the close 2 for affliction / demo

        • Trebor
          Trebor 15 September, 2013, 12:51

          So go with the higher one so it covers the extra tick for afflic and it wont affect demo to much having the extra 1.6k haste as it wont give an extra tick?

          • Sparkuggz
            Sparkuggz 16 September, 2013, 16:45


            well it’s not optimal, you should always reforge but if you want to do it that way yes :D

  25. janosik
    janosik 15 September, 2013, 12:06

    i’ve read somewhere that racial 1% expertise (gnomes – daggers, swords; humans – swords) for spellcasters count as 1% hit…is that true?

  26. Snifles
    Snifles 15 September, 2013, 16:32

    Hello, Spark
    Thanks for the training comments. They have helped my play style a lot.
    I have two questions for you:
    1. If not using imp swarm glyph, is there a decent opener to use? I find myself fury starved during the opener and unable to stay in meta during the entire time of meta if not using the glyph.
    2. I have been reading that some warlocks are using fel flame as a filler instead of shadowbolt, since it does more damage with the recent buff. Should I be doing this even with the high mana cost?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 16 September, 2013, 16:46


      You just need to avoid during many Soul Fire’s sadly. It’s a bit tough without the glyph, you can go out and go back in again before DS falls off. You can use Fel Flame, but you shouldn’t anymore because of the mana cost. Still use it on movement fights, but it’s not really worth it on stand still fights anymore. It’s a good spell that does more then a low haste shadowbolt

  27. kraxx
    kraxx 15 September, 2013, 18:11

    hey sparkuggz,

    thank you much for the guide.

    what trinket do you recommend if i dont have uvls?

    the immerseus trinket and….?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 16 September, 2013, 16:47


      From SoO or what? Try to use the list of trinekts and use accordingly. If you have from previous tier and you only picked up Immerseus, then go with like Breath + Immerseus, but you really need UVLS at some point to be good with Demonology sadly.

      • kraxx
        kraxx 18 September, 2013, 15:11

        hey,
        yes from soo.
        i already read your list, but i am not sure…
        i actually have the immerseus and breath.
        should i prefer blackbook or toxic-totem instead of breath? i sadly dont have uvls jet.
        thank you for help

  28. Questions
    Questions 15 September, 2013, 22:38

    Would you think GoSAC is good for Paragons of Klaxxi Sparkuggz?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 16 September, 2013, 16:48


      Not really, i don’t know why it’ just feels too fury starved to play GoSac these days, you could possibly do it, but GoService works too. I played goService on most encounters

  29. Vexnel
    Vexnel 16 September, 2013, 10:18

    Hi Sparkuggz, I regret to say I’m not as confident in my warlocking as I usually am! I play demonology as my main spec, regardless of the ‘better spec’ for a specific ilvl or fight… Only because I like it more, and I’ve never had to min/max to get progress.
    That being said, I like both other specs as well. I’m happy to play any if my dps suffers due to playing any particular spec.
    Now, onto my question. I sit at ~80-90k dps on a training dummy (Dark Intent as only self-buff), and can’t find anything I do wrong. I track all CDs, wild imps only with dark soul, etc etc. When I was raiding properly in Cataclysm, I always pushed my spec as far as I could. Right now, I feel like I am, but am falling short.
    Vexnel@Darkspear, US servers for the armoury. 516 ilvl. No tier pieces, so everything is sub-optimal, but unsure if that is what’s limiting me or not.

    I apologise for the lengthy comment, but I would greatly appreciate your expert opinion on my situation, regarding improvements, standards I should meet, or more appropriate specs.

    • Vexnel
      Vexnel 16 September, 2013, 12:33

      Sorry, slight mistake – not 516 ilvl as in my comment, but 511.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 16 September, 2013, 16:50


      511 ilvl sounds dangerously low, so don’t take your DPS not being top pair too hard. If you struggle once you get gear, then you possibly have mistakes in your gameplay which is very likely. But comparing 511 ilvl to what exactly? Ofc you can’t do the same DPS as a 550 ilvl person. If you are doing around the DPS your simcraft would tell you to do, it’s not too shabby though. It’s too complicated and hard to tell what DPS to reach at these ilvl’s and you shouldn’t bother too much before you get better gear.

      • Vexnel
        Vexnel 17 September, 2013, 06:06

        Thanks for the reply – and I know I’m not really able to compare to anything (and it’s ‘dangerously low’ as I’ve recently transitioned from PvP to PvE once 5.4 arrived), but I was concerned as there was a nearby warlock, 518-520 (albeit with UVLS + Hydra, both LFR) who was reportedly getting ~160k sustained. Just wanted to make sure I wasn’t doing anything glaringly wrong.
        Once again, thanks for your reply. I might drop by again once I achieve a decent degree of gear.

  30. controllor
    controllor 17 September, 2013, 02:36

    Is there a reason to using shadow blot over fel flames now? other then imps which we can get form our cast of soul fire. I’m seeing fel flame hit for 3 times as much and it is a instant cast.

    thank you for your time.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 22 September, 2013, 10:41


      The mana cost increase makes it not worth it in the long run, but Fel Flame is still more DPS pr 2 globals if Shadowbolt has a +2 sec cast, doesn’t proc the 4P though. But when you move Fel Flame is insanely good spell to use as demonology

  31. Tyler
    Tyler 17 September, 2013, 23:18

    hey spark im 544 ilevel demo and just wondering, as i just got my 2pce t16.. will this in any way affect my priortiy/rotation beause of the 2set bonus?

    • Tyler
      Tyler 18 September, 2013, 03:21

      546 now i guess.
      Feetpics US Arthas

      • Sparkuggz
        Sparkuggz 22 September, 2013, 10:50


        Havn’t figured the 100% best way to handle 2P yet, but you obviously want to try to maximize using the 2P damage increase with being in Meta and possibly Soul Firing and such to burst really heavily.

  32. Starvoid85
    Starvoid85 18 September, 2013, 02:21

    Hello Sparky :D
    Can you tell me….should i trough the glyph of imp swarm into the tresh bin?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 22 September, 2013, 10:55


      You can use the glyph, but you can also not use the glyph. DPS “should” be more without it it. I have been playing without it pretty much since the patch and don’t see the big issue!

  33. Ehoa
    Ehoa 18 September, 2013, 08:34

    Sparkuggz, thankyou for this awesome guide :) i had no clue that ToC did not scale with raid buffs such as hero, so you just saved my dps!

  34. Sprell
    Sprell 18 September, 2013, 14:43

    Hey there, just wondering at what point it will be worth dropping set bonuses from T15. I already dropped my 4p for some major upgrades and now wondering if it will be worth dropping the T15 2p (both 543) for a 561 and 548 item. I will not gain any T16 bonus from doing this.

    Good luck in the heroic race!

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 22 September, 2013, 11:05


      Sounds worth it, the intellect and upgrades you get from ilvl are quite huge. You can always try to sim or compare stat gain vs loss.

  35. bakzel
    bakzel 19 September, 2013, 20:02

    can you give me names of your’s addons plz

  36. Holyground
    Holyground 20 September, 2013, 01:54

    Thank you for your guides. I love them. Just so you know, the idiom is “rule of thumb,” not Thumb rule.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_thumb

    Just because it’s an english idiom. Thanks for the youtube videos.

  37. Airy
    Airy 20 September, 2013, 08:25

    Hey Spark, awesome info for all locks – I have a question about the opening rotation with the 2 piece t16. The old opening rotation doesn’t seem to work well because of how much fury I lose now from breaking the old 2 set. What is your opening rotation like now with the t16 2 set? Simcraft has me at about 500kish burst but I only get up to around 300-350k.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 22 September, 2013, 11:06


      I get out of Metamorphosis during Dark Soul but just do a few casts and do 1x HoG and go back into Metamorphosis. I will make a video after progress to help out a bit in details!

  38. Arioc
    Arioc 20 September, 2013, 08:44

    Is it worth recasting corruption just to be able to spend all my fury on Soul Fire instead of wasting some of it on Touch of Chaos?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 22 September, 2013, 11:07


      You normally keep Corr refreshed with ToC, because you can’t endlessly spam Soul Fire anyway. Just never let Corruption fall off, because we use it for fury gain!

  39. Ironstormy
    Ironstormy 22 September, 2013, 06:29

    Hey spark! Major thanks for this guide, I am a huge fan of yours and wish you all the best in 25m H this week and I also find it massively impressive that you are releasing in-depth guides whilst going for world first, so mad props for that.

    Two quick questions:

    #1.) Should we stick to the basics that you suggest in your 5.3 demo guide (i.e. Glyph of Imp Swarm) as well as the basic rotation before we get our 2p and 4p from T16, or do you think that the class changes were substantial enough that we should put the things from this guide into effect ASAP (eg. Removing glyph of Imp Swarm for more constant Soul Fires) etc.? Long question sorry TL;DR: Is this guide relevant if we still have t15 set bonuses? Or stick to what we were doing before.

    #2.) I have noticed since the patch that my opener has decreased my burst dmg by about 50k-100k (I would usually open for about 400-450k with a personal best of 500k, and now I find I don’t go above 375-400k) and also I have noticed that my overall dps is higher (about 200k up from 180k). Is there any reason for this that you can think of even though I haven’t changed my play style (everything you suggest in your 5.3 guide)

    Thanks again and good luck in SoO! Cheering for you even though I’m on Illidan-US

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 22 September, 2013, 11:12


      The opener changed a lot indeed, we don’t ahve a lot of fury and about the glyph, you can remove it but as said before it’s not that major at the moment. You will need to play it properly without the glyph to gain advantage, but if you aren’t troll / herbalist etc the non glyph gains more advantage because of the whole haste snapshotting.

      I played most fights so far without it and didn’t find it that needed as some other warlocks do. But too early to say yet really!

  40. timbox1234
    timbox1234 23 September, 2013, 01:23

    What opener would be the best in 5,4 ?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 24 September, 2013, 09:59


      Fiddling around with it with the new 2P Bonus, but i will make a video / update the guide once i find a suitable opener!

  41. Kryptic
    Kryptic 24 September, 2013, 01:51

    So with the hot fixes changing UVLS and Wild Imps damage does that change our stat priority? Do we need to prioritize crit higher to proc imps more often?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 24 September, 2013, 10:00


      Early to say, but it would probably be Mastery > Crit > Haste

      • Kôdy
        Kôdy 26 September, 2013, 10:27

        Sparkasse? When Stat priority probably be Mastery > Crit > Haste, haste to cap 8097? Or Are any changes to cap?

  42. Ironstormy
    Ironstormy 24 September, 2013, 05:26

    Spark, is this the end of demo? Is it an AoE burst spec only now?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 24 September, 2013, 10:00


      Seems like a huge hit, becuase it can’t keep up with Affliction on single target now

  43. Priamos
    Priamos 24 September, 2013, 12:12

    Patch 5.4 Hotfixes: September 23

    Affliction
    Haunt now increases all periodic damage against the target by 35% (down from 40%).
    Demonology
    Wild Imps’ Fel Firebolt now deals 30% less damage.
    Destruction
    Immolate damage has been increased by 30%.

    Unerring Vision of Lei Shen now has a 40% reduced chance to activate its effect for Warlocks.

    I wonder how this effects us now and our trinket choices for 5.4

  44. Demonsoulz
    Demonsoulz 24 September, 2013, 13:53

    This really seems like UVLS is gonna be truly worthless now for demo. And even playing demo for single target. I went on ask mr robot and they said to stack crit as demo, did they foresee these nerfs coming lol

  45. zkonvict
    zkonvict 24 September, 2013, 15:37

    Pretty much Killed Demo. UVLS was enough to reduce wild imps damage, then the 30% wild imp damage on top.
    Affliction is just way better now, which seems silly to me since I like switching between specs for certain fights.

  46. Teneye
    Teneye 24 September, 2013, 21:10

    So after about to 10 min of just pure target dummy in org(multi dotted 3 targets) Doom came out with 21.68 mil(16.4% of damage) with imps 20.65mil doing (15.6%) damage with a heavy mastery build with the 8k haste cap. UVLS up time was 4.6%. For the doom I was able to keep most of them rolling with crit’s over normal hits. The nerf is def noticeable though. I hope this helps at all. =D also Ilv was 553 at 94-95% mastery. (sorry I posted in wrong guide.)

    • zkonvict
      zkonvict 25 September, 2013, 14:23

      That doesn’t make sense. 4.6% uptime is 27.6 secs so lets round that to 28 secs = 7 procs.
      If you got 7 procs in ten minutes that means the Trinket is at 0.7 PPM. Which doesn’t seem right at all. I have the Upgraded LFR and it procs at just under 0.5 before the nerf. now after nerf it procs 40% less. so 0.5 * 0.6 = 0.3 procs per minute. Your sample is twice as good as it should be meaning, you just got lucky or hotfix wasn’t in place yet. Cause Heroic trinket at 0.6 ppm *0.6 = .36 ppm. Even if you had that trinket you would be doing double.

      • teneye
        teneye 25 September, 2013, 19:34

        I have the heroic non tf UVLS so my ppm is 0.72 that is also upgraded as well.

        • Miku
          Miku 25 September, 2013, 23:46

          The changes went live with the server maintenence so as of the 24th we were still doing good.

  47. Rivelier
    Rivelier 26 September, 2013, 15:19

    If i decide to play demo as of the hotfix on UVOLS and Imps, what stat priority should i go after? the old haste (8097) > Mastery > Haste (past breakpoint) > Crit or has it changed to something else now?

  48. Limunozaur
    Limunozaur 27 September, 2013, 08:49

    So u stayed demo and secondary specc not chosen so far?

    U took trinket from dark shamans and it wasnt in bis list?

    And u removed UVLS from the equesion,would be lovely if u could explain or answer some questions :)

    • Rivelier
      Rivelier 27 September, 2013, 10:18

      Ye, i’m staying demo because it’s more fun, but i got Affliction as off-specc for when i feel demo won’t do much :)
      Haven’t switched from UVOLS as of yet. Reasons being no other trinket has dropped for me. But i will take Kardri’s Toxic Totem, and Purified Bindings of Immerseus.
      My question should’ve been more like, What is the new stat priority when switching from UVOLS as demo then. Hope that cleared up some miss understandings :)
      Point out more questions you got and i will clear them up as well.

  49. Velef
    Velef 2 October, 2013, 10:13

    What about destruction warlock guide/stats/trinkets?

  50. Zhelapinkult
    Zhelapinkult 3 October, 2013, 19:05

    Hey man I love reading everything you write and it has really helped me a lot, I am currently playing destro and would love a guide like the affi demo ones for destro. Take care and thx for a great site.

  51. arb
    arb 5 October, 2013, 20:28

    JC : 320 Intellect or 320 secondary stats

    - 480 secondary stats, not 320

  52. alexia
    alexia 6 October, 2013, 14:44

    i am wondering with the nerfs to UVLS where it actually sits now in terms of dps. You have a meter on the top of the page which lists the dps output of the trinkets. i am finding my normal UVLS is just shite…

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 7 October, 2013, 17:17


      Check my trinket lists for 5.4 – it showcases that the trinkets aren’t useless but not as good anymore!

  53. Sparkuggz
    Sparkuggz 8 October, 2013, 05:37


    test

  54. Mero
    Mero 8 October, 2013, 09:24

    Hey Spark! Great guide!
    In according with the nerf Blizzard made few days ago when i must prefer Demo over Destro on SoO bosses (exept Thok, obv)?
    Do u go full mastery & haste in Destro spec too or do you prefer crit over haste in this spec?
    Thank you!

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 8 October, 2013, 17:47


      All 3 specs are pretty equal in BIS, you can play them all. Demonology is the most gear based one though

      Destruction spec is Single Target: Mastery > Crit > Haste, but on AoE Haste > Crit. That means its pretty close what we should aim for and nothing really set in stone. Both stats are okay, crit helps a lot for ember regeneration though

  55. kekiesu
    kekiesu 10 October, 2013, 14:40

    Hi Spark,

    Blatty has play demo last sunday. What do you think about it ?
    Have you spoken together ?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 10 October, 2013, 17:10


      What should i have spoken to him about Demonology? It’s still very viable.

  56. kekiesu
    kekiesu 11 October, 2013, 00:08

    Sorry what i wanted to mean is, which stat should we go
    cap haste (8094) than mastery but after that should we take more crit or continue like before ?
    sorry for my english >_<

  57. Pag
    Pag 11 October, 2013, 09:44

    Hey Spark, does mastery > int still remain true?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 11 October, 2013, 20:24


      Mastery was never above intellect, but 2x Mastery is above 1x Intellect in 99% cases at decent ilvl. Since you get 2x Mastery vs 1x Intellect on gems, you need to dbl up your mastery and on AoE fights etc the ratio is in favour of mastery overall.

  58. Luciano
    Luciano 11 October, 2013, 12:34

    make a Destro guide :)

  59. Sparkuggz
    Sparkuggz 11 October, 2013, 22:01


    Updated that it’s no longer at any time beneficial to use Glyph of Wild Imp. Will update the guide more coming weeks to reflect the latest changes more accurate.

  60. ManPants
    ManPants 12 October, 2013, 07:57

    Just throwing this out there, but your 3 trinket dps pictures are out of order. It goes #1, then #3, then #2. Kept throwing me off when thinking about which ones to get.

  61. Sparkuggz
    Sparkuggz 12 October, 2013, 07:59


    # Update

    - Added the new trinket lists
    - Added that haste is slightly better on single target in case some people want to know (1-2% dps differnece)
    - Added that Glyph of Imp Swarm is a DPS loss to use post nerf

  62. Rikkuu
    Rikkuu 13 October, 2013, 09:19

    I just have a small question… how does the opener look like without imp swarm?

    because i guess u cant supply the fury for dark soul right away, like u could with old 2p bonus and more imps

    or does it stay the same?
    thanks

  63. Azzmagic
    Azzmagic 13 October, 2013, 19:07

    hey spar.. just asking..
    on what boss demo is good..
    and here’s my armory..
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/frostmourne/Azzmagic/advanced

    how do you think it is?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 14 October, 2013, 01:33


      Early to say, you can try to browse around on worldoflogs.com and check the fights, compare how people did with the specs. You must remember the data is no suffecient because people thought Demonology was dead, but it’s the easiest way to get some ideas

  64. Azzmagic
    Azzmagic 13 October, 2013, 19:08

    oh yea..
    should i wait for me to get my 4set to change to demo? or should i change it now.. i miss demo so much

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 14 October, 2013, 01:34


      You mainly need Blackblood + Purified and pretty high ilvl to get it working good. 2P for sure, 4P isn’t game breaking

      • Xotli
        Xotli 14 October, 2013, 15:50

        Hi,
        My Spec ist Demo, und Destro, i have ilvl 554.
        Is Mastery > 8097 Haste > Crit or Mastery > Crit > Hatse better?

        • Sparkuggz
          Sparkuggz 15 October, 2013, 21:31


          Mastery > Haste Cap > Crit , you don’t want to s tack crit as Demonology if you use Blackblood or UVLS trinkets

  65. Vaan
    Vaan 18 October, 2013, 01:59

    Hello,I wonder when Blackblood proc what should I do, just treat it as UVLS proc in 5.3(full time DOOM when 10 stock)? If yes,should I cast as much SoulFire as possible in the remaining 8s. You know ,in 5.4 the Demo is very different from the Sacrifice Demo with UVLS in 5.3. My ilvl 565 ,Mastery > Haste > Crit.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 18 October, 2013, 05:32


      You want to doom with 10 stack, and you want to Soul Fire while it builds up. I’m not sure what you ment with the last part!

      • Vaan
        Vaan 18 October, 2013, 06:01

        I mean when Blackblood proc, should I cast SoulFire in Demo Form immediately, until Blackblood get 9-10 stock then cast DOOM?I just wonder how to use the Blackblood right, because it is quite different from the UVLS in 5.3 Patch.Sorry about my English.

        • Sparkuggz
          Sparkuggz 18 October, 2013, 06:18


          Yea thats what i said, and obviously in Metamorphosis :P

          • Vaan
            Vaan 18 October, 2013, 06:34

            Thanx. I have one last question, I read your latest 5.4 Trinket lists. After UVLS 40% nerf,should I choose 535+8 yulon’s bite instead of heroic UVLS. And yulon’s bite scores higher than 553 Blackblood in SimC, it;s really amazing!

            • Sparkuggz
              Sparkuggz 18 October, 2013, 08:08


              The list is post UVLS nerf, i’m not really sure why Yulon’s bite is going like this, might be a bug. It’s not the 535 version for sure.

  66. mr2toes
    mr2toes 21 October, 2013, 01:33

    Hey spark I got a question for you that I can’t really seem to find the answer to. Is it better to try to maximize 2pc up time for the whole fight by spending MC procs till your next DS while not over writing it and using ToC in meta, or is it better to bank MC procs for DS burn and spend all my fury on soul fire?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 21 October, 2013, 15:16


      Havn’t really figured out the best best best way, but we obviously want to have a steady flow of MC procs to obtain maximum uptime of 2P for the duration of the fight, but it’s obviously most important during Metamorphosis times.

  67. Methens
    Methens 25 October, 2013, 12:40

    Hi Sparko, thnx for all the good guides!!
    I had some questions.
    1. I was wondering if glyph of Imp swarm was worth it for burst scenarios?
    Like in CM’s perhaps or the proving grounds.
    1.1 In CM’s (463iLvL) what would be best stat to go for, all mastery? or gem for int/mastery?

    Thnx.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 27 October, 2013, 11:35


      Nah, i would never use Glyph of the Imp Swarm, i mean if you find something where the imps at that exact time would help you immensly go ahead! But i cannot judge that for you!

      Go intellect / mastery imo for lower item level, at least not full mastery

    • Karsteck
      Karsteck 12 November, 2013, 09:15

      I did gold CMs in 5.1, gemming int. In non-red sockets, int/mastery or int/hit. Of course, some of it was my raid gear at the time, with haste gems for aff. I reforged to be just past a shadowflame breakpoint, and then mastery then crit. Possibly gemming mastery would be effective, you’d have to look at your CM logs and see how much of your dmg was from stuff affected by your demon-form dmg%. If it’s a lot, then maybe mastery over int. I’d be very surprised if gemming for haste or crit was a win, but IDK between int and mastery. If you’re missing the mastery raidbuff in your group, gemming it might have more value relative to int.

      Also note that you probably only want 12% hit for challenge mode, as you do most of your dmg on lvl92 trash, not the bosses. If you play demo in CM, you’re there to melt the trash. Dark Soul is best used on any trash pack that lives long and that you enter with enough fury to immo aura the whole time, while other people have CDs that might be more of a gain on single target.

      30% of my dmg being from shadowflame was not uncommon over a whole instance, so it helps a lot to get the extra tick to give more time for fillers between HoG, filler filler, HoG -> meta. And the extra fury gem. And of course crit / mastery boosts felstorm, but haste doesn’t.

      Some trash doesn’t stay up long enough for full double-stacking HoG to work well, so know when to save the charge for the next pack to double-stack at the start. On longer trash pulls, it also prob. hurts that void ray will no longer keep corruption rolling, so tab ToC I guess. The changes to KJ’s cunning hurt, too. Dumping molten core stacks on the last mob while moving up / getting towards next pack was really nice. However, I think the new AD letting you time DS when it’s needed (as you drop the 2nd HoG early in a pack, or use it twice on the last boss) will compensate.

      Make sure to keep aura of the elements up. Axe toss is OP for locking down dangerous mobs, so is glyphed carrion swarm for aoe interrupts on packs of casters.

      • Karsteck
        Karsteck 12 November, 2013, 09:27

        Forgot to say, the nerf to mannoroths fury (no passive increase to HoG cleave radius) will hurt a lot. I ran mannoroth’s most of the time, only swapping to KJs mid instance for e.g. the 2nd half of shado-pan monastery I think. (always be moving for Sha Spike so you don’t have to react)

        For gear, you usually want the lowest ilvl you can get, with ideal stats, so you can gear more hit/mastery pieces without being over hit cap. I used a bunch of 466-upgraded pvp gear. Crafted 476 pvp gear will work fine if you don’t have good old stuff.

  68. Lykasha
    Lykasha 26 October, 2013, 13:42

    Hey Sparkuggz,

    I’m a big fan of you and your good work! Keep it up at all cost. =P

    I rerolled WL (from Disci Priest – boa dude, that was boring.. ;D) in ToT and your youtube page helped me out a lot! I was so in love with Demonology in the last patch.. I hope that I can get my hands on the BBoY soon to play that specc again! Would love it so freakn much.

    BTW: Your new homepage is super duper awesome! Love it!

    greetings from germany

  69. Chase
    Chase 27 October, 2013, 05:38

    Hey Sparkz,
    I’ve recently been farming HM Lei Shen for the Heroic Thunderforged version of UVLS but I haven’t been having luck, I have the raid find version at the moment and from one of your previous comments you mentioned that we should use raid find over most HM SoO trinkets. After looking at your trinket list you’ve ranked UVLS raid find lower than the other trinkets I actually own. Should I use your trinket list as a bible or is UVLS just still insane for Demo and I should use it regardless?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 27 October, 2013, 11:41


      You can trash it pretty much, it’s too RNG and not fun to play with. Even if you do get good procs it’s 1 out of 100 tries with the LFR version. Trash it imo, you can CONSIDER it very so slightly on paragons or protectors but i wouldn’t. I wouldn’t play Demonology before i have BBoY anyway

  70. Brapsticle
    Brapsticle 30 October, 2013, 13:04

    Hello,
    I am a 561 ilevel demo lock with WF totem and Flexi PBI (only trinkets i have gotten from SoO so far, although i have a normal UVLS in my bags). My guild have just cleared normal and I have been playing demo the whole patch so far because I enjoy it and find I am still doing good enough dps at the moment, always around 200-300k depends depending on the amount of cleave. I was just wondering if there is anything which demo really needs to be keep up with destro/affli (like in ToT UVLS made it king). Or if you believe if I could play destro/affli to the same level that I know demo weather it would be a better option to respec.

    My armoury – http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/silvermoon/Brapsticle/simple

    Any advice would be greatly appretiated.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 31 October, 2013, 14:00


      Item level and Blackbood is the key for Demonology. The lower item level the more the spec suffer, more so then the other two tbh. Affliction and Demonology is rather gear depended, while you can do good with DEstruction in all levels.

  71. Soulnado
    Soulnado 31 October, 2013, 06:42

    Hello Sparkuggz,

    I was wondering what the stat priority would be since the nerfs hit Demo for imps and UVLS? Right now I’m main specking Destro with a stat priority of Mastery > Crit > Haste. But, there are a few fights that Destro doesn’t do so well on and I want to play Demo for. I don’t have the UVLS trinket since it was nerf’d, so I’m wondering if sticking with the current stat priority would still be a good idea? Or, if I need to hit the 5.3 haste cap of 8097 > Mastery > Crit > Haste? Basically I’m trying to find the best synergy between the two specs while avoid losing any Mastery if possible, but I’m pretty sure I will drop below 100% Mastery if I do in fact need to reach that Haste cap again. (1mil+ CBs and SBs are awesome to see in raids.)

    If It helps here’s a link to my armory page:
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/area-52/Soulnado/advanced

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 31 October, 2013, 14:11


      I havn’t played much around with DEmonology. Haste is supposed to work really well for single target. You do not want to stack crit when you have blackblood, becuase a 10 stack doom with blackblood delivers like 60% crit on that doom. It’s haste vs mastery as Demonology, crit is rather 3rd tier again. You can go more crit i you play without BB or UVLS, but then you can’t really play Demonology in the first place.

      All stats are pretty equal for Demonology

      I would just go for Mastery > Haste > Crit as demo, and Mastery > Haste = Crit as DEstruction, reforging a bit of haste into crit

  72. ManPants
    ManPants 31 October, 2013, 18:36

    Do the haste caps change when you have purified bindings of immersius? If so, how should i reforge accordingly?

  73. Rivelier
    Rivelier 31 October, 2013, 21:30

    got a question regarding the 2p for Demonology, does it change how we should prioritize Soul Fire? or we just keep using it as we did before?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 6 November, 2013, 00:14


      You want to have more uptime of the buff, still debates wether to just use only soul fires inside metamorphosis or not. Safe to say you want a overall high uptime though!

  74. Fernando
    Fernando 2 November, 2013, 18:45

    Could you do a video tutorial of the demonology rotation?

  75. Shayan
    Shayan 3 November, 2013, 07:02

    What’s your idea thought on using chaos wave during darksoul CD? It’s dmg difference from HoD is quite considerable during darksoul.

    • Shizwix
      Shizwix 3 November, 2013, 13:41

      Bad idea. Better off spending your fury on soul fires. Plus Shadowflame generates fury and molten core procs, of which we do not have as many of these days.

      Chaos wave is bad, only use it on burst aoe where lots of adds need to die in like 2-3 seconds etc.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 6 November, 2013, 00:24


      Don’t, you do HoG + Sflame for the ticks and buffing it with Metamorphosis, not to mention the fact you gain molten core procs

  76. Spaceboogies
    Spaceboogies 4 November, 2013, 09:12

    Hey Sparkuggz, curious, from this post, you have gone destro/afflic, are there any fights where u prefer demo. Also what fight are beneficial as demo, obviously fights such as protectors and paragons are beneficial, but are there any others you prefer demo over destro/afflic? I am wanting to go demo, but im also wanting to progress in my 10 man guild. here is my armory: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/frostmourne/Spaceboogies/advanced

    Any suggestions? should i just stay afflic/destro or should i go destro/demo? i mean is it worth going demo over afflic ( i dont particularly like afflic, well just havent really nailed the rotation as much as i can yet)

    • shizwix
      shizwix 4 November, 2013, 10:21

      You have the ilvl and trinkets to play demo so ditch that afflic spec if you want. Demo can be played on a lot of fights this tier.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 6 November, 2013, 00:28


      I honestly can’t say i find any fight where Demonology is better or equal to the two specs (yet). I havn’t played it much myself, havn’t felt it out but even on protectors both Affliction and Destruction outshines Demonology.

      • Karsteck
        Karsteck 12 November, 2013, 08:52

        Thok is a fight where demo has an advantage over the other two specs. Outside of devo aura / unending resolve, you can”t really get any casts off at high stacks. aff / destro can spam fel flame, but demo can touch of chaos. And more of your dmg is your pet (which is actually a loss when the boss is outrunning your pet, though).

        Also, the high armour of demon form is a nice boost vs. physical raid damage like thok’s roars, and even enough to get a mine on iron juggernaut (10N, anyway, would need sac pact instead of soul link, or unending resolve, if they did any more dmg).

        • Sparkuggz
          Sparkuggz 15 November, 2013, 10:30


          It’s still not better DPS on Thok sadly, so there isn’t really any fights it’s better. Wish it wasnt the case, but it is. Destruction and Affliction outdoes Demonology quite heavily.

          Survival wise, yea demo isn’t bad, but destruction ember tap is quite overpowered too though.

  77. Chase
    Chase 6 November, 2013, 18:30

    Hi again Sparkz,

    My guild recently started progressing on 10 man HM Immerseus, we have an average ilvl of 549 and are sort of struggling with the enrage after one night, it feels like the adds are taking too long to die and we aren’t getting enough dps time for the boss. Would you recommend demonology for this fight in my scenario? I’m currently destruction with no Black Blood or HM UVLS, tbh I don’t think there will be too much of a difference but I know that demo use to excel in this sort of fight and from your first HM Imerseous kill you had 4 demo locks so they are obviously a good choice for this fight :).

    P.S. I am 544 ilvl.

    • Chase
      Chase 6 November, 2013, 18:33

      I just went through the most recent logs and i’ve found pretty much all high ranking dps for this fight are destro locks, I think I just answered my own question but if you were able to elaborate that would be cool :).

      Cheers.

      • Sparkuggz
        Sparkuggz 7 November, 2013, 17:00


        Destruction is good for that fight, so stick with it. I’m not sure why you are hitting enrage, sounds like some people are really pulling poor DPS.

        • Karsteck
          Karsteck 12 November, 2013, 08:44

          Enrage on immerseus is probably because you’re not getting rid of enough corruption on each phase2. Root one, kill or heal another, come back to the rooted one. off-spec heals on puddles enough to slow them down can do a LOT, to give heals a chance to get to it after healing one of their own. If you’re low on hybrid heals, you could even symbiosis a mage or lock to give them a heal. Mage preferably, since all the healing up front will slow the add farther from the boss than warlock rejuv. Both heal for a lot, though.

  78. Alexis
    Alexis 8 November, 2013, 12:03

    Hey sparkuggz. I was wondering about the demo opener. I remember you had a demo opener for 5.3 with ULVS. But since most people dont use ULVS and due to the changes on procrate the opener changed?

    What would the demo opener look like for 5.4?

    Alexis

    • Infectika
      Infectika 12 November, 2013, 01:05

      I also wondered about this because we no longer have the old 2 or 4 set, so getting enough fury to stay in meta for any noticeable amount of time on the pull seems difficult.

    • Lykasha
      Lykasha 12 November, 2013, 09:13

      Looks pretty equal to the 5.3 opener.

      If you are lucky and have the BBoY you just have to be sure to refresh your doom at 10 stacks to get arround ~ 60% crit.
      Else just go back to metaform before DS ends and burn all the fury with soulfires/ToC

      • Infectika
        Infectika 13 November, 2013, 04:29

        Im finding myself really fury starved using his same opener, what are you guys doing differently?

        • Lykasha
          Lykasha 13 November, 2013, 07:48

          That’s just ‘normal’ without 2p t15. Don’t like that,too. :(

          Opener is just the same…
          - GoServ, corruption, HoG, CDs, 1 – 2 shadowbolts (depends on your haste) HoG, Metaform.
          - all trinkets should procc now.
          use some MC soulfires with all trinkets lined up till you end up having no more fury.
          - cast some shadowbolts and go back to metaform before dark soul fades
          - push out the rest of your MC proccs with soulfire

        • Sparkuggz
          Sparkuggz 15 November, 2013, 10:39


          You have no fury in the opener anymore, just need to do some pre casts and stuff

  79. Cornelius
    Cornelius 14 November, 2013, 09:59

    hey sparkuggz, great guide.
    i was playing my demo lock and startet wondering about corruption, i’ve heard that it’s onely for fury generating purposes, so when im in metamorph, and it’s corruption is on full duration and im just spamming soulfire, if i then get either a big master buff, a big haste buff, a big int buff or a big crit buff, in what of the 4 casees do i wanna throw in an extra ToC instead of just keep spamming soulfire.
    logic tells me that: when corruption onely gives fury per tick, and onely haste gives more ticks, i should onely refresh it when i get haste, in order to generate most possible fury, for least possible GCD’s.
    Regards Natibu from Tarren Mill

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 15 November, 2013, 10:45


      Check how much corruption hits for, it’s so low the dmg you increase by renewing it is irrelevant. You can do a ToC before going out of meta so it runs with some procs vs none, one global wont cost you much since you have to renew corr anyway. But you can figure it out easily, it’s nothing worth thinking about!

  80. Alex
    Alex 14 November, 2013, 23:12

    Not sure if someone asked this already, but does anyone know if Demo T16 4PC procs consume Fury, while casting ToC in Meta?

  81. leech
    leech 15 November, 2013, 16:36

    looking up world of logs for demo locks, i keep seeing shinafae topping ranks, ilvl aside, hes running Glyph of imp swarm on just about every fight as demo, thoughts?

    • Soulswitch
      Soulswitch 17 November, 2013, 21:43

      I assume it’s to keep the fury up. I’ve tested it just now after seeing your post and i have noticed that I am able to stay in Meta a bit longer than I do without the Glyph of Imp Swarm. More Meta up-time is always nice, especially now since without the 2pc-t15 we’re so fury-starved.

      • Sparkuggz
        Sparkuggz 18 November, 2013, 00:41


        You only get more Metamorphosis in the opener, overall you get less because you loose quite a few imps overall

    • Dazzai
      Dazzai 17 November, 2013, 22:38

      She :P

  82. Fernando
    Fernando 20 November, 2013, 21:56

    is it worth to use haste gems to reach the cap?

  83. Betty
    Betty 21 November, 2013, 02:43

    Heya just a quick question.

    I am trying to bring love back into my warlock since it had to go destro. I’m currently progressing on Paragons HC and am wondering (since in your kill vid you was demo) would it still be beneficial to go demo for it and keep dooms rolling with gosac as in the other council fights or ‘shiver’ go aff for it? I’m 572ilvl with a very heavy mastery> crit > haste build.

    Cheers

    • Danjackiels
      Danjackiels 21 November, 2013, 14:44

      His killvideo was before the 30% imp and lei shen trinket nerf. :)
      I do not think, that it is still the best specc for that fight.

      Destro should do well, too. Affli would may bring higher numbers, but since you have to focus one target, Destro should do best.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 28 November, 2013, 13:23


      Go destruction gosac and just multi dot immolate and nuke the skulls, you can put RoF on +2 targets

  84. Ramalama
    Ramalama 21 November, 2013, 07:46

    If Glyph of Imp Swarm is a no go now, how do we get our burst at the start of a fight?

    • Shayan
      Shayan 24 November, 2013, 00:23

      A very important matter imo.
      I my self am very looking forward to ur response on this spark. I’ve been literally doing 20 dps tests on dummy everyday for optimizing my demonology opener whilst considering it’s resulting impact on ur sustainded dps over the course of raid encounters and here’s my opinion:
      The opener for demonology isn’t defined in 20 sec timeframe at the beginning of an encounter but rather in the first 1 min of the encounter. We have 200 fury at the beginning. U must consider popping ur 2 darksouls charges 2 within the 1st minute. the first DS is a few secs after the start when u’ve cast ur HoGs, corruption and possibily 1-2 SB. because BL, skulbanner, and most likely ur two trinket procs + legendary metagem proc are up at that. this is all because u want to cast ur doom on the targets. U’ll run out of fury with 10 secons of Ds remaining on u ofc but here’s when ur second DS comes to play.
      Ur spawning imps, HoG and haste boosts from raid buffs will allow u to gather up both fury and a lot of MC procs within 40-45 seconds afterwards, enough to cast ur 2nd DS and purely spend ur whole time casting soulfire. I’ve found that if u withhold casting soulfire outside of metamorphosis during ur 1st DS, U’ll probably end up having atleast 6-7 MC procs for ur second DS.
      So in conclusion: don worry about the numbers the meter shows for the first 20 seconds of the encounter, U’ll never be able to Top retro pala’s or mage’s numbers in that time frame but watch how it’ll turn out after 1 minute. during the dark shamans encounter after 30-40 seconds into the fight I took a look at my surroundings and I was shocked to see I’ve had an uncountable number of imps around me, all thanks to the dooms that I chose to spread on the four targets with all the snapshotted procs. the thing is my dps number was already quite high at that moment but the good news was I was then ready to pop my second DS and surprise everyone with the result on the dps rankings in the 20 seconds to come.

    • Shayan
      Shayan 24 November, 2013, 00:55

      and btw as u already might know the talent “archimond’s” darkness” never meant that u can use AD twice as much. once u use ur 2 charges It’ll go back to limiting 1 use per 2 minutes. also keep in mind that once u use 1 charge + meta while u have capped fury, U’ll never have enough to use the second one right away. this concludes that ur 2nd DS charge has to be the one for which u have stacked MC and fury. So basically there’s no better use for the talent except for a semi back to back usage at the start of encounter as described. (In my opinion ofc :P)

  85. extremefear
    extremefear 28 November, 2013, 17:08

    I was actually wondering about Shadow bolt vs Fel flame.

    SB has a base damage of 1,896 at a cast time of 2.5 sec and generates 25 demonic fury. Divide the damage by the cast time
    SB does 758.4 damage with 10 demonic fury per sec.

    Fel Flame does 1,168 damage while generating 15 demonic fury per sec

    At my current stat.
    SB does 78,591 dps demonic fury at 25
    Cast time is 1.95 so it’s 40,303 dps demonic fury at 12.82

    Fel Flame does 48,408 dps at demonic fury of 15

    SB is still not high enough in dps and demonic fury generation.

    The only time I see SB beat Fel flame in dps is when my sinister primal diamond procs and my shadow bolt has a cast time of 1.5 secs.

    Does this mean I should use fel flame over Shadow bolt? (I mostly use SB to summon imps)

    • Fernando
      Fernando 30 November, 2013, 02:47

      I was wondering about this today, but for me, it’s insane to think about using fel flame over SB

    • Shizwix
      Shizwix 2 December, 2013, 22:16

      The increase to fel flame’s mana cost made it better to just use shadowbolt, as you save GCD’s on life tapping less. Also the fact that your 4 piece procs extra hand of gul’dan’s means shadowbolt is by far the better option.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 20 December, 2013, 21:57


      It’ simply cost too much mana to use it as a filler, but it’s very good for moving and playing without KJC and taking AD / MF instead. Fel Flame is very viable DPS, just high mana cost to obtain!

  86. Fernando
    Fernando 1 December, 2013, 22:42

    is the timeless trinket Yu’lon’s Bite good for demonology warlock?

  87. Nixtruction
    Nixtruction 5 December, 2013, 14:14

    Sorry to bother you, but if you could answer these two questions of mine I’d be very grateful – I’ve started learning demo some time ago, and am trying to optimize it as much as possible (am playing Destruction MS, so my reforges are Mastery > Crit, while keeping 10124 haste.

    When we’re relatively high on fury, and on molten core procs, is it more worthwhile to spend fury on ToC to avoid capping out and spend some MC outside meta to regain fury?
    Or is it better to spend some MC inside meta and regain fury with shadow bolt?

    The other question is about multidot scenarios as Demo. Should I try to always refresh corruption via ToC on more than one target? Or is the toll it takes on my fury too high?

    If the gear makes an impact on rotation, This is a link to my armory. I own a 536(NTF) UVLS, so if needed I could replace KTT (although it’s probably not a good idea? your input please)

    http://eu.battle.net/wow/pt/character/twisting-nether/Nixtruction/simple

    Thanks in advance!!

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 20 December, 2013, 21:50


      Your main goal is to keep the 2P T16 bonus up a lot, since it’s such a huge DPS boost. Keeping corruption on multi targets is key, to keep fury coming in. You should Soul Fire in Metamorphosis, especially if you have trinkets and molten core procs availble.

      Don’t use too much Soul Fire outside Metamorphosis

      Replace your trinkets asap, but a “must have” for Demonology is to get Blackblood, because it gives you 60~~% crit with full stacks

  88. Eyescar
    Eyescar 12 January, 2014, 20:49

    Nicely done guide Sparkuggz. I’m kinda new to Warlocks and I love Demonology spec.
    What do you consider for stat reforging when I have Normal Wushoolay’s and Flex Immerseus trinket?
    Some people(including mr robot) recommended the Crit build with 8097 Haste, but I don’t know if it’s best. Thanks,

  89. Deathkïss
    Deathkïss 23 January, 2014, 09:44

    Do u intend to atualize this guide bro? i’ve tried tons of dif things and can’t even pull 300k with my 562 gear *.*
    I’ve read this like 10x, i pass 2h/day atacking dummy and i still can’t pull the same or something near destro/affli

    And ur guide talks a bit about Lei Shen’s trinket which is no longer viable

    • Danjackiels
      Danjackiels 23 January, 2014, 10:07

      Hey Dude, this guide is actual and got some updates already.

      Do you have the BBoY? If BBoY isn’t yours, you will never come as close to destro or affli. Not even, if you play demo perfect.

      BBoY is the new “mini” UVLS and a must have as demo-lock

      • Liquidsteel
        Liquidsteel 23 January, 2014, 22:36

        “If BBoY isn’t yours, you will never come as close to destro or affli. Not even, if you play demo perfect.”

        This isn’t true. I played Demo this reset with KTT heroic (still only have normal BBoY) and did just fine. Beat/came close to 3 other equal geared locks playing Destro/Affliction on many of the fights.

        Once I finally get BBoY Heroic I will of course use that, but it isn’t a 100% “you cannot play demo without this trinket” affair.

        • Sparkuggz
          Sparkuggz 26 January, 2014, 00:57


          Mjae, it’s still quite major though Liquid, it’s not as crucial as BBoY is for Affliction but it’s def a god tier trinket for Demonology once you min max the spec. The 10 stack doom is 60% crit vs half the intellect on a KTT proc

          • Liquidsteel
            Liquidsteel 26 January, 2014, 09:19

            Indeed, once I get the heroic version (only seen 2 drop so far) I’ll be using that without any qualms, but considering how easy hc KTT is to get in comparison, you don’t HAVE to use a normal BBoY over it. I’ve been messing around with Demo quite a bit on farm when I get the chance and N BBoY vs HC KTT falls into the variance of how good your RNG was on the pull.

    • Deathkïss
      Deathkïss 24 January, 2014, 04:10

      I feel like i can’t control fury perfectly
      i always gets out of fury with 6-8s remaining on Dark Soul

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 26 January, 2014, 01:00


      There is a few things you can update, but trust me it’s not the guides fault if you dont reach your desired numbers. There isn’t something crucial wrong that would effect your DPS. But i don’t know what you are comparing your DPS too, target dummy is always a bad place to compare DPS with much?

  90. Deathkïss
    Deathkïss 24 January, 2014, 21:45

    Spark, what do u think about Shinafae’s new reforge?
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/illidan/Shinafae/simple
    She’s picking Mastery>Crit>Haste now

    • Liquidsteel
      Liquidsteel 24 January, 2014, 23:45

      She has always played Demo this way.

      • Deathkïss
        Deathkïss 25 January, 2014, 05:45

        i started checking her armory 1 month ago and yesterday was the first time i saw her using that reforge =X

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 26 January, 2014, 00:56


      Shina always does her own thing, regardless what its not major DPS either way. I know Zinning in Blood Legion plays the heavier haste now then crit, so yea i’m not doing that much stuff with Demonology these days to give much opinion on either way. Secondary stats after first main stat is always not as important as people make out

  91. Dizii
    Dizii 11 February, 2014, 11:50

    Hi spar why using mastery gem but no haste gem ?ty

  92. gabriavis
    gabriavis 15 February, 2014, 10:31

    dude ive been watching your vids for a very long time and now you have a site its awesome :D, look forward to getting my info for locks from here now :D

  93. ManPants
    ManPants 4 March, 2014, 05:21

    This was probably answered but I got tired of reading through all the comments. You say that demo locks should still keep using UVLS, correct? That make me a little confused about trinkets. Should i use nm UVLS and flex purified bindings, or flex purified bindings and flex kadris toxic totem since its higher on the dps chart than UVLS?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 4 March, 2014, 09:53


      No, don’t use UVLS anymore. Black blood is the replacement of UVLS mechanics since it gives so much int it turns into a mini UVLS

      • Botouls
        Botouls 22 March, 2014, 23:18

        In my case I still don’t have a Black Blood, I have a 502 UVLS, flex Purified Bindings and a 522 Breath of Hydra, in this situation should I keep my UVLS, or it doesn’t matter ’cause I’m undergeared?

  94. Tauti
    Tauti 16 March, 2014, 15:54

    not sure if you have been playing around demonology for fun/rankings but isn’t the 4set t16 pretty weak? When boss goes 25% hp, you will be spamming SF most of the time, thus the proc from 4set bonus almost never procs. So that’s why, wouldn’t it be better go with 2set and off pieces, like affliction?

    • Liquidsteel
      Liquidsteel 16 March, 2014, 18:05

      Nah the 4 set is really good. In caster form the 2 piece procs aid fury generation from extra ticks of Shadowflame, plus give you more molten core procs for you to play with.

      In demon form the 4 set equals quite a few extra molten procs throughout the entire fight. For example in my last iron juggernaut kill, I had 7 chaos waves from 4 set, which equaled 7 extra soul fires (I hit 25% with 0 molten core stacks).

      • Liquidsteel
        Liquidsteel 16 March, 2014, 18:07

        Also, any time we have more than one target (hmm that’s like nearly every fight in SoO :D) we benefit quite a bit from the 4 set, as the procs can obviously cleave.

      • Sparkuggz
        Sparkuggz 16 March, 2014, 19:36


        amen

  95. Nesoi
    Nesoi 17 March, 2014, 02:15

    When do you think we will see a video for this spec?

  96. Alphric
    Alphric 20 March, 2014, 05:41

    Do you still stick by the stat priority listed above? I kind of got into a little debate over stats with a fellow lock and he was doing haste cap > crit > haste > mastery…. I dig the heavy mastery and that is what it looks like a lot of people are going for. I even snooped Shina and it looked like she was going haste cap>mastery>crit>haste.
    Any input?

    • Alphric
      Alphric 20 March, 2014, 06:36

      If it’s stated above…perhaps even multiple times…then I apologize, 222 comments is pretty daunting to try to skim through for stats.

  97. Markulino
    Markulino 21 March, 2014, 04:57

    I’m sitting on a 549 ilvl Demo and I don’t know if I should still sit on the 8097 soft cap or if I should aim for a higher cap…

  98. Fernando
    Fernando 30 March, 2014, 21:58

    Is it worth going 9211 haste for corruption haste cap?

  99. Alphric
    Alphric 30 March, 2014, 23:36

    “The only caps we really aim for as Demonology would be haste caps around Doom or Shadowflame ticks, Corruption is nearly irrelevant as Demonology because the damage is so low.”

    • Fernando
      Fernando 2 April, 2014, 17:33

      well, thank you. It’s just that I have almost 9211, and I can’t reforge to less than this, so I was thinking about going a little bit higher

  100. Ramada a
    Ramada a 1 April, 2014, 03:06

    Hey sparkuggz, I tried finding the answer to my question on your site but I couldn’t find it. So I absolutely despise destro and I really want to go back to demo, but I can’t let the hunter in my raid beat me In dps. So I was hoping with my 564 item level lock, with flex BBoY and normal PBI if I could go back demo and still be competitive with that bastard hunter. Thank you kindly, sir.

  101. msquel
    msquel 1 April, 2014, 15:42

    Love the website, just taking a little time to ask you for clarification on your use of the apostrophe, which has me reading the sentences wonky. Specifically confused by your writing in the Grimoire of Sacrifice which I read different ways depending on if you are punctuating correctly or if I need to decipher what you meant to say.

    First, “it’s” is a contraction for “it is” and is not used as a possessive 3rd person singular adjective. If you want to say it has (a car) you would say its car. You can also use its for more than one thing,

    Ok now take a noun such as imp and you want to make it possess something (such as “the imp’s color is blue”) then you would use that apostophe on imp and it modifies another word such as “that imp’s spell is strong.” If you wanted to take the word imps (plural) and say that the imps have something you would use the apostrophe: “the imps’ power is greater on single target spells.”

    Doom’s means “belonging to Doom” or “Doom’s modification of blah” such as “Doom’s effect on blady blah is great.”

    And I’m such a destro noob I really did get confused. Please let me know if I can help you in any way. I think any negative in your site is far outweighed by your knowledge of the subject.

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 2 April, 2014, 23:25


      English is not my main language but i highly doubt there are things completly unreadable for you.

  102. alphric
    alphric 3 April, 2014, 01:47

    Damn son! Plus you can say buttfucked in English, so that’s good enough!

  103. Johan
    Johan 12 April, 2014, 14:20

    If you would rate the warlock specs in challange modes. Witch once Will be best and worse?

  104. denzildk
    denzildk 20 April, 2014, 22:15

    i have 2 quick questions that i couldent find an specific answer on in the guide:
    1. The passive we have called Wild imps, does that scale with haste, i need this for a weakaura i have counting down the time before i get the buff again so i sometimes can time a trigger for it so i get my imp instantly, but i use the timer statet on the buff but it dosent always work correctly(pentachecked the aura, it’s not the problem) XD
    2. With the pandemic passive we have, why do we go for haste breakpoint’s, i get that haste in itself is great, but if we, as we should, always recast ou’r dots before they end to keep 100% uptime, why not just simcraft the best haste/mastery set and go with that instead of the breakpoints?

    • Liquidsteel
      Liquidsteel 21 April, 2014, 09:40

      1) Yes it does.

      2) Haste breakpoints in MoP are good because hitting a breakpoint causes the DoT to go back up to its Max duration. This means less GCD’s spent refreshing the DoT, and more time spent nuking. They aren’t massively important for Affliction IMO, but you’re asking in the Demonology thread so here goes.

      Specificially to Demonology, you have two kinds of breakpoints you want to hit. The first is a Shadowflame breakpoint. This DoT DOES expire, and so we want to maximise its usefulness in Damage, Fury, and Molten Core generation.

      The second is a Doom breakpoint, specifically one for a bloodlust/heroism pull where you have all your haste procs up. Doom is a significant portion of your damage, and in my most recent Malkorok parse, was critting for just under 1M damage (without skull banner) on a 4.6 second tick interval. That’s insane.

      For Trolls, a common breakpoint is 14880. This allows you to hit the 14873 BP for +3 ticks of Shadowflame, as well as 14880 BP for +8 ticks of Doom on a pull with Bloodlust, Meta Gem, and Berserking active. This allows you to still maximise mastery for those unwilling to go full haste.

  105. Fernando
    Fernando 27 April, 2014, 02:59

    Why no Lightweave on the cape?

  106. Jas
    Jas 13 May, 2014, 12:10

    Any chance of a guide or video about managing fury? this is one thing I struggle with, I find when I soul fire it takes a chunk and nothing is coming back, even with my dots up on a target. my just need more practice.
    Also is UVLS still viable, and should I try and get this vs other trinkets? I have looked at the trinkets above and it looks very strong.
    here is a link to my alt warlock, any advice would be appreciated.http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/ghostlands/N%c3%a1tasha/simple

  107. Arvid
    Arvid 19 June, 2014, 00:12

    Hi Sparkuggz thx for this guide i just wanna know what is the best gear to have from ordos?

    • Sparkuggz
      Sparkuggz 23 June, 2014, 11:57


      Not sure what you want to know about Ordos gear? Always get gear with the best stat itemization

  108. Fernando
    Fernando 7 July, 2014, 20:46

    Does the glyph of shadow bolt really improve molten core procs?

  109. Crôwley
    Crôwley 25 September, 2014, 06:58

    I guess stat priority has changed a bit where u have to favor crit over haste and mastery, at least based on askmrrobot… help me out with that plz

    • Superbugger
      Superbugger 26 September, 2014, 21:20

      Askmrobot hasn’t updated its demo stat priority’s for a long time, but from personal experience and Simcraft I find Haste>Mastery>Crit to be the most effective (at least at 580+ ilvs)

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